Spirited Away and Noodles.

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Spirited Away and Noodles.

Postby TectonicMuse » Tue Sep 11, 2012 10:04 pm

Pretty short notice, but this Saturday (the 15th) There will apparently be a free outdoor public screening of Miyazaki's "Spirited Away", and an attached noodle eating contest courtesy of the "The Rolling Road Show" of Alamo Drafthouse Cinema.
http://drafthouse.com/blog/entry/the_ro ... l_features

I'm not super familiar with Alamo. Apparently they took over control of The Mainstreet 6 from AMC, and they seem to play a lot of older movies, similar to screenland.
The prominent screening of Spirited Away isn't completely surprising due movies relative popularity in cinema; but hopefully, it's indicative of a support for showing anime and import as well.
Why they chose to screen it alongside "Pee-wee's Big Adventure" however, I don't have a clue.

Like I said, it's pretty short notice, but the city market is a cool area, and if I can manage to finagle myself out of work, I'd definitely go. Any other takers?
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Re: Spirited Away and Noodles.

Postby bakamatt » Wed Sep 12, 2012 11:16 am

Thanks much for the head's-up. I, of course, won't be at an event that starts at 8:00 PM, but any chance to see a Miyazaki on a big screen is worth thinking about.
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Re: Spirited Away and Noodles.

Postby TectonicMuse » Wed Sep 12, 2012 1:03 pm

Ah, just to note; I'm not sure, but according to their calander, the time of the event is actually 7:00, though the Poster says 8.
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Re: Spirited Away and Noodles.

Postby ca_jas » Sat Sep 15, 2012 12:01 am

Doors open at 7, movie stars at 8. I think I'll be at this with a small group.
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Re: Spirited Away and Noodles.

Postby TectonicMuse » Sat Sep 15, 2012 11:48 pm

It was a good show. Well set up show with a great resolution. (I think they said they were using an actual 35mm film?).
Anyway I had forgotten how good spirited away was with the exception of truly terrible english voice casting on the part of Haku. His dialogue was pretty morbid too. So it goes~
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Re: Spirited Away and Noodles.

Postby ca_jas » Sun Sep 16, 2012 12:51 am

lol How do you find fault in his dub? I had to look up on youtube exactly what you were talking about. The only debate seems to revolve around the "age" of the character not matching the voice. Is that the issue? If you really want to see a terrible dub of a Miyazaki film watch Castle in the Sky. Me, a super fan of dubs, could not watch it in English, unbearable.

I remember the first ASK-C event I went to, when it was a class in the Communiversity, I overheard some members talking about how atrocious the English adaption of Princess Mononoke was, that the script was completely butchered. I couldn't believe what I was hearing. Comme ci, comme ca I guess.
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Re: Spirited Away and Noodles.

Postby bakamatt » Sun Sep 16, 2012 6:52 am

How many people were there? Could you get any feel for what percentage of the audience were already anime fans and what were mundane?

Over the years, dubs have gotten a lot better; they used to be uniformly awful.

And I still prefer the original soundtrack and subtitles. As I see it, the problem is that too many American voice actors come out of American kids' cartoons, and that inflects their style. The Disney releases are about the best there are, because they use actors with years of experience playing adults. And, of course, sometimes actors that are just better actors, since they've got the budget to do so.
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Re: Spirited Away and Noodles.

Postby TectonicMuse » Mon Sep 17, 2012 12:11 am

I would post a video, but I could not find one referencing the particular parts I was referencing.

All in all the problem with haku's v.a. was that it seemed to detach from the feel of the rest of the movie. The tone of his voice wasn't "bad" per say, but it didn't seem to me to fit
haku's characterization and visual style at all.

The detached feel of the character wasn't completely his fault either. Many of his lines had to reveal a lot of information in a short amount of time,
and whoever translated his script didn't seem to be successful in making them flow well despite this fact.

I really can't explain my feelings about it too much better than this; If I had the movie in front of us I could point it out.

All in all, I have to say his voice was really the only one that bothered me, which is a big deal since I am pretty critical of Disney's voice acting work with Ghibli films anyway.
Arriety, for example, was a vocal disaster; and the redub of My neighbor Totoro in my opinion (though the majority disagree with me) I find completely criminal.

Ah, I should also clarify that I don't dislike dubs in general by any means. Until somewhat recently I didn't really watch subbed anime much at all actually.
But I think it's worth something to have actors who specialize in just voice work. The biggest problem with dubs I think are the way that they're handled.
From what I've heard, most of the time VAs don't really have much notice regarding type of character they'll be doing before a session, let alone the context of the anime that they're in.
On top of that, they get paid per session. so most of the time companies try to cram as much voice work into as small a time as possible in order to cut costs.
Given these circumstances, I have a lot of respect for those English voice actors who can fairly consistently put out good work.
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Re: Spirited Away and Noodles.

Postby TectonicMuse » Mon Sep 17, 2012 12:28 am

ca_jas wrote:lol How do you find fault in his dub? I had to look up on youtube exactly what you were talking about. The only debate seems to revolve around the "age" of the character not matching the voice. Is that the issue? If you really want to see a terrible dub of a Miyazaki film watch Castle in the Sky. Me, a super fan of dubs, could not watch it in English, unbearable.

I remember the first ASK-C event I went to, when it was a class in the Communiversity, I overheard some members talking about how atrocious the English adaption of Princess Mononoke was, that the script was completely butchered. I couldn't believe what I was hearing. Comme ci, comme ca I guess.



I can't speak to Castle in the Sky as I can barely remember it at this point; but I don't mind saying that I somewhat agree with the stuff about Princess Mononoke.
I'm willing to bet that a lot of this stems from whatever one's original exposure to these movies was.
The direction that they are probably taking is that the movie doesn't really leave an impression that matches up well with the culture that modern English voices bring to mind.
It's a sense that can be summed up as "my brain can't quite consolidate what I'm hearing with what I'm seeing".
That doesn't limit itself to just the voice acting either though.
There is an entire mentality that becomes somewhat obscured in remarketing of a product. Take the original Japanese trailer for Mononoke v.s. the original U.S. Trailer.





If you still disagree, I don't mind. Just trying to show what the thought process might be on this side.
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Re: Spirited Away and Noodles.

Postby TectonicMuse » Mon Sep 17, 2012 12:32 am

bakamatt wrote:How many people were there? Could you get any feel for what percentage of the audience were already anime fans and what were mundane?


You know it was hard to get a feel for that. It was a full lawn and there were few obviously anime fans, but there were a lot of families, indie-types, and "probably nominal" fans of the movie there as well.
I guess I shouldn't be too surprised given that it was a free show. I guess it's to be expected from the general popularity of the movie; but said popularity is the more surprising thing to me given how strange it is.
If only more "regular folks" would give other anime a try, I'm sure they'd enjoy it. ^-^
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Re: Spirited Away and Noodles.

Postby bakamatt » Mon Sep 17, 2012 8:10 am

TectonicMuse wrote:The direction that they are probably taking is that the movie doesn't really leave an impression that matches up well with the culture that modern English voices bring to mind.

It's a sense that can be summed up as "my brain can't quite consolidate what I'm hearing with what I'm seeing".


That's certainly my take on it. Given a choice, I want my foreign stuff as foreign as possible. But for some viewers the foreign-ness is a feature, for others it's a bug.

If only more "regular folks" would give other anime a try, I'm sure they'd enjoy it. ^-^


Statistically, probably. But it's a high hurdle. Most Americans can't get past their preconceived notions of what cartoons "are." At this point I'm firmly convinced that anime fans are discovered, not created.
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Re: Spirited Away and Noodles.

Postby ca_jas » Mon Sep 17, 2012 12:00 pm

Man, I'm not going to go into an in depth argument on this but Princess Mononoke, imo, is one of the most emotionally engaging dubs of an anime movie. I probably should compare it to the original japanese but I find no reason to when I enjoy the adaption so much. I'm not sure if there is a drastic script change or change of tone that is the glaring difference. Sometimes those changes are for the better (sometimes). I always think about the two dubs of Akira. The first Streamline dub consists of (I assume) a shotty script adaption and all these whiney VAs with weird accents that can't pronounce names right. The second dub seems to stick closer to the original script and contains VAs that match the tone of the original Japanese a little better. However, I can't help but enjoy the Streamline version way more. So much more emotion! Akira spoiler but I think most of us are familiar with the "KAANEEDDAA" scene!

Spoiler: show


So I while fans like Bakamatt are nobly looking for the original foreign experience, I'm looking for whichever experience is more immersive.

Though I could have done without Billy Bob Thorton in PM. What the heck??
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Re: Spirited Away and Noodles.

Postby bakamatt » Mon Sep 17, 2012 3:11 pm

ca_jas wrote:Man, I'm not going to go into an in depth argument on this but Princess Mononoke, imo, is one of the most emotionally engaging dubs of an anime movie.


I wish you would go into a little more depth. Specifically, I can't tell if it's the English script, the English actors, or both, that make the dub so successful for you.

The English cast is entirely respectable. The English script was written by Neil Gaiman, he of Sandman, Stardust, American Gods and, I gather, a really sharp recent episode of Doctor Who. (It was while he was researching Mononoke that he got the idea for Sandman: The Dream Hunter.)

I think most of us are familiar with the "KAANEEDDAA" scene!


I'm more of a "MIAKAAAAA!" "TAMAHOMEEEEE!" (Fushigi Yuugi) scream kind of guy...
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Re: Spirited Away and Noodles.

Postby ca_jas » Wed Sep 19, 2012 4:28 pm

bakamatt wrote:
ca_jas wrote:Man, I'm not going to go into an in depth argument on this but Princess Mononoke, imo, is one of the most emotionally engaging dubs of an anime movie.


I wish you would go into a little more depth. Specifically, I can't tell if it's the English script, the English actors, or both, that make the dub so successful for you.

The English cast is entirely respectable. The English script was written by Neil Gaiman, he of Sandman, Stardust, American Gods and, I gather, a really sharp recent episode of Doctor Who. (It was while he was researching Mononoke that he got the idea for Sandman: The Dream Hunter.)

In some ways I am just fighting hyperbole with hyperbole. I won't go line by line in my defense, but for anyone to suggest the english dub completely butchered the original, well I'm just going to say it is the greatest until someone shows me a better anime movie adaption.
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Re: Spirited Away and Noodles.

Postby Tsunami3k » Thu Sep 20, 2012 9:42 pm

I can offer up my perspective if it's of any relevance to anyone. I'm very much of a utilitarian mindset when it comes to the voice acting for a show, be it sub or dub. While anime is the sum of many elements, it is first and foremost a visual medium. As such, the existence of a dub facilitates my ability to focus on that pivotal aspect of the work rather than split my attention between reading text and appreciating the visuals. Take, for instance, His and her Circumstances. The series is littered with scores of extremely brief non-verbal cues and emotive subtleties any one of which I'd have risked missing had I watched the subtitled version.

I do appreciate the availability of the subtitled track as on rare occasion the dubs, typically older ones, can be a bit grating. As hammy as older dubs can be I think seriously flawed dubs are largely a thing of the past as most dubbing outfits like Funimation and the ADV spinoffs tend to hire genuine actors to do voice work rather than seek out experienced domestic cartoon talent. That said, even domestic cartoons have shed much of their ham as they've taken on more mature themes and stories in recent years.
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